Recreational angling NOW permitted under Lockdown 3

[JonC]

21 minutes ago, Maverick said:

Bloody hell John where on earth do you live.  I only want to know so I can avoid the fuel costs involved in getting services lol

I live in st Lawrence bay Essex. No, I know you haven’t heard of it. You may have heard of Bradwell ( John Rawls - Bob Cox territory) that’s the next stop just before the end of the world. 

[GPSguru]

 

Particulary for @Andy135 and @Odyssey

Tonight has been an interesting development.

I would think that the NPCC (National Police Chiefs Council) and ACPO (Association of Chief Police Officers) have briefed their membership following the BBC article and questioning the validity of enforcement. The D&C Police chief was on the local TV news this evening saying that his officers will Police by 'engagement' and offer 'words of advice' where appropriate. He also added that enforcement will be a last resort to those that have clearly breeched the lockdown laws put into place by the government. He went on to say that the job of the Police was not to alienate or antagonize the public as this loses public respect for the Police, and they rely on that respect to do an effective job, not only now, but also in the years to come ............. strangely enough, he didn't mention anything about dogfish !

 

 

Edited January 8, 2021 by GPSguru

[Andy135]

I've heard TVP say the same but prior to this lockdown.

One of the parents at my son's school is an officer and he told my wife that their force focuses their efforts on large house parties and gatherings and that they don't do individual stops or beauty spot stakeouts. Whether that will change with this new lockdown... who knows.

[GPSguru]

1 minute ago, Andy135 said:

I've heard TVP say the same but prior to this lockdown.

One of the parents at my son's school is an officer and he told my wife that their force focuses their efforts on large house parties and gatherings and that they don't do individual stops or beauty spot stakeouts. Whether that will change with this new lockdown... who knows.

Yes, it makes huge sense in the public eye for them to be clamping down on large gatherings, and folk that travel huge distances to holiday homes.

Let us hope that common sense will prevail ............ it is a good job that @JonC and @Saintly Fish are not Police officers 🤣

[JonC]

12 minutes ago, GPSguru said:

Yes, it makes huge sense in the public eye for them to be clamping down on large gatherings, and folk that travel huge distances to holiday homes.

Let us hope that common sense will prevail ............ it is a good job that @JonC and @Saintly Fish are not Police officers 🤣

I am a higher authority. I will see retribution where it’s due. I’m a believer in Korma. 

[GPSguru]

 

Ok, so a new development, and an admission of over zealous policing ...........

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-derbyshire-55594244

From the article the important 'U-turn' wording,

Derbyshire Police initially said driving to exercise was "not in the spirit" of lockdown.

But it now says new national guidelines mean it will review its position.

In a statement, the force said all of its fixed penalties issued during the new national lockdown will be reviewed.

 

Back peddling big time as you can't issue a FPN when no law have been breeched ..............

 

Edited January 8, 2021 by GPSguru

[Andy135]

Yes, I just read the same. A potentially significant development.

[GPSguru]

2 hours ago, Andy135 said:

Yes, I just read the same. A potentially significant development.

 

It is shocking when people of authority have to be told how to do their job 🙄

The Guidance issued by the NPCC is potentially a game changer for you Andy 👍

 In a statement, the force said further guidance issued by the National Police Chiefs Council (NPCC) had "clarified the policing response concerning travel and exercise".

The guidance said: "The Covid regulations which officers enforce and which enables them to issue FPNs [fixed penalty notices] for breaches, do not restrict the distance travelled for exercise."

Edited January 9, 2021 by GPSguru

[Maverick]

9 hours ago, GPSguru said:

It is shocking when people of authority have to be told how to do their job

It is kind of shocking however, not that the police get it wrong as I believe in actual fact they didn't get it wrong as it was an interpretation of a poorly worded instruction.  It is the politicians or law makers that have yet again been woolly and left it to others to decipher what they actually mean.  It is actually very unfair of law makers not to be decisive with their wording then instruct others to enforce and subsequently take the flack for a wording cock up.

I'm not saying the police are right or wrong and neither saying that the ladies who have been fined are right or wrong as the blame should lay 100% with those further up the ladder who are always very good a dropping shit on those below them.

[Andy135]

Another day, another change of direction? This morning's headlines include one about government and police now cracking down on enforcement of rules, rather than engagement with the public. 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/blogs-the-papers-55597265

[Geoff]

Due to the nature of our villages, towns and cities the word "local" may mean 5 miles to some and perhaps 50 to others, so it is very difficult to define and for the police and other authorities to police. The two  Derbyshire women were treated in a heavy handed way and would have benefitted more from discussion and advice. The people that went on a "seal sightseeing" trip were just taking the mickey IMHO. There obviously does need to be some better way of defining what is and what is not permitted, but the whole exercise is intended to limit the spread of this horrible virus and we should all be looking to abide by the spirit of containment and not look for loopholes to enable us to do whatever we wish. I have not left the house since mid December, and my wife (there are just the two of us) has been to the local supermarket on two occasions during the same time. Until this virus is under control all of us need to play our part in this, and not just try to convince ourselves that what we do does not matter - it does. Geoff.

[suzook12]

45 minutes ago, Geoff said:

Due to the nature of our villages, towns and cities the word "local" may mean 5 miles to some and perhaps 50 to others, so it is very difficult to define and for the police and other authorities to police. The two  Derbyshire women were treated in a heavy handed way and would have benefitted more from discussion and advice. The people that went on a "seal sightseeing" trip were just taking the mickey IMHO. There obviously does need to be some better way of defining what is and what is not permitted, but the whole exercise is intended to limit the spread of this horrible virus and we should all be looking to abide by the spirit of containment and not look for loopholes to enable us to do whatever we wish. I have not left the house since mid December, and my wife (there are just the two of us) has been to the local supermarket on two occasions during the same time. Until this virus is under control all of us need to play our part in this, and not just try to convince ourselves that what we do does not matter - it does. Geoff.

If the law was the same as the "advice, it would be clear enough. We are advised not to leave village/town/city area in which we live except for work blah blah blah, had that been included in the law, then we would all know where we stand..... Like I said, I can fish within my village, or walk along the river, whereas I would consider hitting the beach at Kelling area a piss take as its the other side of the county. What they have now done, is more or less said its ok to travel 40 miles or so to go fishing....... I was initially pleased that the 2 women had been hit with a fine, as that would deter the idiots, now they've been given free licence again.

That being said, means we can now ( I include myself in this) "escort" my mate to his funeral as he would have wished. Now being on a bike, with helmet etc on, doesn't involve much risk of spreading the virus, it is after all , an escort, not a social gathering.......

[Andy135]

10 minutes ago, suzook12 said:

What they have now done, is more or less said its ok to travel 40 miles or so to go fishing....... I was initially pleased that the 2 women had been hit with a fine, as that would deter the idiots, now they've been given free licence again.

I agree Steve. That was exactly my thinking after I saw this article this morning...

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-55587460

Despite the fact that the article states that fishing should be "local", there will always be those who don't read past the headline and then assume they have carte blanche to fish wherever they choose...

[captin slows old outlaw]

18 hours ago, Odyssey said:

Maybe should have a contact details section so we can post bail for @Andy135 for when is arrested on his way to his boat for a dogfish catching session.

I understand that the call of the dogfish is quite strong for him 😉

you could say he was dog ed about it he he

[GPSguru]

1 hour ago, Andy135 said:

Another day, another change of direction? This morning's headlines include one about government and police now cracking down on enforcement of rules, rather than engagement with the public. 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/blogs-the-papers-55597265

Indeed, however I can reassure you that the crackdown will be aimed at gatherings, business non compliance, and social distancing, as some of those in London and the SE are still choosing to ignore the very necessary rules. 🙄

[GPSguru]

Interesting

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-55587460

[suzook12]

Same article as Andy posted.... Good article though. Just a shame about the grey areas left in legislation

 

[suzook12]

I see supermarkets are now limiting certain goods again, which means that for some, I now have to go to the supermarket more frequently, increasing my chances of coming into contact with, and then spreading covid...... Fuckin awesome!! I hate shopping at the best of times, yet alone when the shops are full of disease ridden arseholes who think it's ok to push past you etc etc....... Can I sue tescos for contracting covid?

[captin slows old outlaw]

25 minutes ago, suzook12 said:

I see supermarkets are now limiting certain goods again, which means that for some, I now have to go to the supermarket more frequently, increasing my chances of coming into contact with, and then spreading covid...... Fuckin awesome!! I hate shopping at the best of times, yet alone when the shops are full of disease ridden arseholes who think it's ok to push past you etc etc....... Can I sue tescos for contracting covid?

go on line and get a delivery mate i do

[GPSguru]

3 hours ago, Maverick said:

It is kind of shocking however, not that the police get it wrong as I believe in actual fact they didn't get it wrong as it was an interpretation of a poorly worded instruction.  It is the politicians or law makers that have yet again been woolly and left it to others to decipher what they actually mean.  It is actually very unfair of law makers not to be decisive with their wording then instruct others to enforce and subsequently take the flack for a wording cock up.

I'm not saying the police are right or wrong and neither saying that the ladies who have been fined are right or wrong as the blame should lay 100% with those further up the ladder who are always very good a dropping shit on those below them.

Well yes, but I would expect the chief Police officer and his advisory team to take advice on what was passed into law and apply it accordingly. Pretty poor show of Police leadership IMHO.

[JonC]

6 minutes ago, GPSguru said:

Well yes, but I would expect the chief Police officer and his advisory team to take advice on what was passed into law and apply it accordingly. Pretty poor show of Police leadership IMHO.

You don’t have to look too far back to see the PM making press statements where he didn’t know the rules so very harsh to criticise any police force for struggling to get their heads around it. 

[suzook12]

19 minutes ago, captin slows old outlaw said:

go on line and get a delivery mate i do

We do, but when they have no bog roll, you have to go hunting for it, or when they limit you on things like milk, it usually means I have to physically go shop for it.....

[captin slows old outlaw]

2 minutes ago, suzook12 said:

We do, but when they have no bog roll, you have to go hunting for it, or when they limit you on things like milk, it usually means I have to physically go shop for it.....

that is true

[GPSguru]

52 minutes ago, JonC said:

You don’t have to look too far back to see the PM making press statements where he didn’t know the rules so very harsh to criticise any police force for struggling to get their heads around it. 

There is a huge difference between not knowing the rules and enforcing what is published and clearly written into statute law. 
99% of law is quite clear as often precedents have been set in courts to clear up to odd anomalies. It is often the case that law advisors apply the basis of precedents to new laws in order to understand their implications.

For me, this is a black and white issue, with the overriding question of ‘Has a law been breached ? If yes, then the breached law including the ‘act’ and ‘paragraph’ should be quoted and the appropriate penalty issued. FFS it is not rocket science.

 

 

 

 

Edited January 9, 2021 by GPSguru

[captin slows old outlaw]

1 minute ago, GPSguru said:

There is a huge difference between not knowing the rules and enforcing what is published and clearly written into statute law. 
99% of law is quite clear as often precedents have been set in courts the clear up to odd anomolies. It is often the case that law advisors apply the the basis of precedents to new laws in order to understand there implications.

for me this is a black and white issue, with the overriding question of ‘Has a law been breached ? If yes, then the breached law including the ‘act’ and ‘paragraph’ should be quoted and the appropriate penalty issued. FFS it is not rocket science.

 

 

 

 

i agrea but there are quite a few only see what they whant to see, and that word but gets over yoused, if the punshment was harsh then i think there would be more clarty